AC: What is the source of your compassion for other people and your interest in their welfare?

JL: It's because, as I told you, as a kid I was sick for fifteen years. I was a raving psychotic maniac—aches and pains, the kids making fun of me at school, and my brother beating me up all the time—it was just incredible! So I have compassion for those people who are sick. They need help! Also, my mother with her religious training—she always taught me about humility and caring for people. That's what she pounded into my head, so that's probably where it comes from. There's no doubt about it. Your home training has to mean so much, right? So that's an example of it.

AC: But Jack, you seem like you really care. This just doesn't seem like something that you were taught.

JL: I care more than . . . you cannot believe how much I care! I want to help somebody! Jesus, when he was on the earth, he was out there helping people, right? Why did he perform those miracles? To call attention to his profession. Why do you think I do these incredible feats on my birthdays? To call attention to my profession! When I first started out, I was considered a crackpot. The doctors used to say, "Don't go to that Jack LaLanne, you'll get hemorrhoids, you won't get an erection, you women will look like men, you athletes will get muscle-bound"—this is what I had to go through. So I had to get people believing in me. "What does this Jack LaLanne have that I want?" I had to prove it. So I put handcuffs on and swam from Alcatraz, which is supposed to be escape-proof. Well, that called attention to my profession. "Gee, the guy is not a bunch of bull after all"—you know—and the athletes, they said, "Well, if he can swim like that, and if he won the Mr. America contest and all this stuff, he's got to have something going." Now I'm not comparing myself to Jesus, but I'm just telling you what I had to do to call attention to my profession.

AC: There's something that comes out of you, though, a kind of passion that does seem to me to be very similar, or almost identical, to a spiritual or religious passion.

JL: Well, it is. It is a religion with me. It's a way of life. A religion is a way of life, isn't it? As I told you, I believe in a Supreme Being. I believe in this power that's been given to me, and I'm using it. We all have it, but we don't bring it out. And that's why I said that my profession should be taught from the pulpit. Some of these poor people who are sick and tired and miserable and thinking of suicide, they think that the only thing to do is to say a couple of prayers. You've got to get to these people and say, "Look, you can do it, but it's got to come from you. God's going to give you the power, but you have to take responsibility."

AC: God helps those who help themselves?

JL: Absolutely. He helps them to do what they want to do—to eat better, to exercise, to think better, to have more pride and more discipline, to be more compassionate toward other people, and not lie to themselves or to anybody else. These are all things that are there for us. But it's just like food on the table; if you don't go there and eat it, what good is it? What good is the spiritual aspect of life if people don't put it into their daily lives? What good are all these wonderful tools that we have if we don't use them?

AC: Often, when you're speaking about diet and nutrition, you also speak about integrity and honesty—

JL: They go hand in hand; it's all a part of it.

AC: Obviously we live in a world where a lot of people don't have integrity and don't live honestly in the way that you're speaking about, but in the way you talk about honesty and integrity, it almost sounds as if these are also natural laws that must be obeyed.

JL: That's exactly how I feel—I'm that passionate about it! You see, there are certain things that have been handed down for thousands of years, certain axioms that were true then and are true now. Like two plus two is four—it'll never be six and a half and it'll never be nine, right? Well, there are truths that go along with my profession and they're axioms—you've got to do these things. How you treat people and how you act are so important because the most important person in the world is you. Think about it. A lot of people complain, "Oh, my husband, and my this and my that, and my kids. . . ." But what good are those kids, what good is your husband, if you're no good, if you're all fouled up mentally, physically, and you're sick all the time and you're not doing the things you're supposed to do? If you're not an example, then you're not motivating anybody. In fact, you're really making a lot of people suffer by not taking care of the most important person in the world. Now it's hard for me to talk like this because my mother always said to be humble—but it's the truth. I'm not doing all this stuff so you'll say, "Gee, Jack, you're a wonderful guy"; it's because I've got to do the best I possibly can and set my standards high so that the people who come to my lectures will follow them. That's my responsibility because I know that in all these billions of years of existence, there's just one of you and one of me. Doesn't that mean anything? So if you can't afford half an hour three or four times a week to take care of the most priceless possession on this earth, which is your body, then you've got to be a bit psycho.

Now a lot of people say, "Oh, I don't have the time." Or, "Oh, but I don't like it, Jack." But you know, I try to get to the gym by five in the morning, and I work out for two hours. To leave a hot bed and a hot woman to go to a cold gym—now that's dedication! And I've never heard this once—knock, knock, knock on the window in my gym: "Jack, this is Jesus. I'll work out for you today!" So that's the message we have to give all these people, that "we are fearfully and wonderfully made"—and we goof it up. If you're tired and pooped out all the time, do you have love and compassion in your heart for your fellowman? You don't even like yourself!

You know, that's the only thing that I get really sad about. I see a sea of millions of people going down with their own negative thoughts, going down for the third time in this big sea of iniquity and negativity, and I feel like I've got the life preserver, but all I can do is say, "Grab it!"

AC: So in terms of the distinction between self-mastery and enlightenment, in your view are they the same or are they different?

JL: They're interwoven. You can't separate spirituality and self-mastery. Without spirituality, you can't have self-mastery because self-mastery is being able to control your emotions and control your life, and without this Supreme Being—this "God" or whatever you want to call it—without that power, you couldn't do it. You see, I'm using the power that this Supreme Being has given me to help me control Jack LaLanne; otherwise I'd be an animal. We are the chosen ones on this earth, we humans. We're a step higher. You know, it's just amazing what we have; we only scratch the surface of what we've got, but where is the limit? There is no limit. But this power, if you think about it, can also be used negatively—it can bring about wars and other terrible things. So is this power that we have for good or for bad? It all comes down to the choices that we make.

AC: What are the qualities of a human being who's achieved self-mastery?

JL: They're going to be kinder, more generous, more fun to be around, more productive, and they're going to be better parents, better husbands, better lovers, better citizens-—everything about them is going to be better. Why? Because they've got control! If I've got control, I'm not going to lie to people, I'm not going to murder people, and I'm not going to cheat them; I'm going to be a good human being, and if somebody needs help, I'm going to help them.

AC: So self-control is the key to liberation, to freedom.

JL: Right. You see, as I said, it's a whole thing, a perfect circle; without one you can't have the other.

AC: In your book, you write about the role of prayer and meditation. Could you speak a little bit about that?

JL: Well, the Supreme Being that's put us on this earth and that controls everything, I give my thanks to this Supreme Being.

AC: So you mean prayer and meditation as an expression of gratitude?

JL: Yes, absolutely—and we should be grateful! I express my gratitude all during the day; without even thinking, I just do it. When I'm driving my car, I say, "Gee, you've got a new Corvette, Jack, and how lucky you are to be living here in this wonderful country, and boy, you've got these lectures, you're going to reach thousands of people, and think of what a great wife you have"—these things are just in my brain. In other words, I try to keep all the negative stuff out of my brain because negativity is like a poison. It develops an acid condition in your body, and some of these people who go to see psychiatrists are caught in that negative net.

It's tough to do, but you've got to work at living, you know? Most people work at dying, but anybody can die; the easiest thing on this earth is to die. But to live takes guts; it takes energy, vitality; it takes thought, and you've got to have this pride, this discipline that we've been talking about. We have so many negative influences out there that are pulling us down. Thinking about the wars all over the world and the starving people and all this stuff just gets in your brain—and you've got to be strong to overcome these adversities. That's why you've got to plow ahead; that's why I never stop. Negativity is what kills you. Thoughts are things, thoughts are things!

AC: I've read that your first interest has always been people, and that even though you're not a poor man, you could have been a lot richer if you were interested in money.

JL: I make money—more than I'll ever use, as much as I want—but I will not sacrifice my integrity! It's got to be what I believe in and what it's going to do for the people. It would just kill me to do something that I knew was going to be wrong, you know? I'm hard on myself; I'm my own taskmaster. Even my wife says, "Oh, eat this, come on, Jack, nobody's going to know." I can't do it—nuts! But it pleases me. As I said, the most important person on this earth is me. After all, if I'm no good, how am I going to be a good husband, or a good father, or whatever? You are you and I am me, and I have to live with my conscience. So it's really simple: Just don't screw up.

AC: That is all it takes, but it seems to be quite a big thing, what you've just said—"It's really simple: Just don't screw up."

JL: Yeah, well, a lot goes on. You've got to keep having challenges. . . . Life's just great, isn't it? Isn't life just great?

AC: Is there anything you're still striving to achieve?

JL: I feel like I haven't done anything yet! I really do! I've got so much stuff inside me you can't believe it. I want to get to more people. In fact, I'm thinking of going back on television again. Do you know how potent I would be on television right now, at my age? Being able to do all the things I can do?

AC: Oh, unbelievable, unimaginable.

JL: Well, you see, this is exactly what I've got in my mind! Going back on again, five days a week—and do you know what the people want? They want me to do exactly what I did before. When I first started that show, I didn't know the first thing about television. But every day I'd give an inspirational talk—that anything in life is possible and it's never too late, right? Then there'd be a one—minute nutritional tip, and a little bit about what we were going to do the next day. And everything I did was for that person there at home. I had only one thing in my mind: "How can I make them healthier and happier? How can I make them better people?" And if there was one thing I knew, it was that I had to be the example. Otherwise, it could never happen.